After a hard day furiously debating politics, it is nice to relax and discuss films.

[00:47] <@Ethanol> rofl in Terminator: Salvation, John Conner uses the good old 240 volt make-shift defibrillator trick to resuscitate his terminator friend
[00:48] <@Ethanol> if you are looking for worn-out Hollywood cliques, this movie has them alll
[00:48] <@Ethanol> -l
[00:49] <@Tigger_> heh
[00:50] <@Ethanol> this particular model of terminator has a human heart
[00:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's a shit film
[00:51] <@Ethanol> indeed
[00:51] <@Ethanol> I have fell asleep while watching T4 for 3 nights in a row
[00:52] <+PrometheanStardust> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IdAb24SnRk
[00:52] <@Ethanol> fell=fallen
[00:53] <@Tigger_> T4 is so heavily filtered and processed that it has a resolution like a 700mb avi
[00:54] <@SoleilMoonFrye> can't believe they went ahead with it
[00:54] <@SoleilMoonFrye> with that script
[00:54] <@Tigger_> by the same scriptwriters as Catwoman
[00:54] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it goes nowhere
[00:55] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the terminators in it look terrible
[00:55] <@SoleilMoonFrye> T2 looks a million times better than it
[00:55] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's such a dissapointment
[00:55] <@SoleilMoonFrye> james cameron could have made these 2 recent films so good
[00:56] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he would have made T3 so good
[00:56] <@Tigger_> he was asked to direct them, he said no
[00:56] <@SoleilMoonFrye> T3 is a lot better than the latest
[00:56] <@SoleilMoonFrye> just cos it sticks with a lot of the original concept
[00:56] <@SoleilMoonFrye> T4 is just souless
[00:57] <+xm> like dance music
[00:57] <@Tigger_> I thought T3 was worse, just a remake of T2, including a truck chase
[00:57] <@SoleilMoonFrye> Cameron must laugh when he sees these 
[00:57] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah but that is all terminator was ever supposed to be
[00:57] <@Tigger_> T4 stole from Mad Max 2 as well
[00:57] <@SoleilMoonFrye> trying to elevate it above what it is is silly
[00:57] <@SoleilMoonFrye> they all steal from mad max
[00:57] <@Tigger_> the Terminator TV show was good
[00:58] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[00:58] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the TV show stuck with the concept though
[00:58] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's just about one big chase
[00:58] <@SoleilMoonFrye> cameron always knew that
[00:58] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and based it all around that
[00:59] <@Ethanol> I was expecting to see humans hiding in underground bunkers from the continual onslaught of the terminators (as depicted in the original movie). Instead, the terminators seem subdued. The humans are pretty much free to operate open field airbases and the like.
[00:59] <@Tigger_> I am depressed that the show was cancelled
[00:59] <@Tigger_> yes
[00:59] <@SoleilMoonFrye> We should view T2: Director's cut for Movie Club.
[00:59] <+xm> ive only got season 2 eps from the net
[00:59] <+xm> the local p2p
[01:00] <+xm> but they dont have season 1
[01:00] <+xm> and i cant find season 1 on mininova either
[01:00] <@Tigger_> it should be both T1 and T2
[01:00] <@Ethanol> I have both movies on super low-def VCD :p
[01:00] <@SoleilMoonFrye> T4 showed just how shit Christian Bale is.
[01:01] <@Tigger_> lol VCD, so malaysian
[01:01] <@SoleilMoonFrye> 400mb VCDs
[01:01] <@SoleilMoonFrye> classic
[01:02] <@SoleilMoonFrye> God I hope there are not plans for T5
[01:02] <@Ethanol> there is
[01:02] <@SoleilMoonFrye> That first season of Tv terminator was great
[01:02] <@Ethanol> they were planning a trilogy
[01:02] <@Ethanol> new trilogy
[01:02] <@Ethanol> T4 was the first of the new trilogy
[01:03] <@SoleilMoonFrye> James Cameron should have held onto the rights. Just so no one else could ruin it like they have.
[01:03] <@Tigger_> T5 will be made regardless that critics hated T4
[01:04] <@SoleilMoonFrye> Hopefully in an interview for the upcoming Avatar Cameron discusses what he thinks of the recent terminator films
[01:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that would be very interesting to hear his views on them
[01:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he's a player though so he probably wouldn't comment.
[01:05] <@Tigger_> he is probably paid to shut up
[01:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yup
[01:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i can only imagine what he would have thought when he was shown T3 and now T4
[01:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> say what you like about cameron but he's a fucking smart guy
[01:06] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he'd probably have been repulsed by them
[01:06] <@SoleilMoonFrye> I would never let something go like terminator if i'd come up with it
[01:06] <@Tigger_> he probably doesn't care anymore
[01:06] <@SoleilMoonFrye> a lot of idiots probably still think he had something to do with these new films
[01:07] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[01:07] <@Tigger_> and is ashamed that he was doing something so violent, when he always wanted to do women's romance movies like Titanic
[01:07] <@SoleilMoonFrye> whatever he was paid to hand over the rights would have been a hell of a lot of money
[01:07] <@SoleilMoonFrye> lol
[01:08] * PrometheanStardust (~Prom@188c10f1.tpgi.com.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
[01:08] <@SoleilMoonFrye> terminator and T2 were pretty violent films
[01:09] <@Tigger_> btw, this is what Linda Hamilton looks like today:  http://www.celebritysmackblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/linda-hamilton-51.jpg
[01:09] <@SoleilMoonFrye> god t4 was bad
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[01:09] <@SoleilMoonFrye> ouch that's not a flattering shot
[01:10] <@SoleilMoonFrye> she's a millionaire though, she doesn't have to work
[01:10] <@Tigger_> I watched Children of the Corn last week, she was probably at her best in that
[01:10] <@SoleilMoonFrye> t2 was her best 
[01:11] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it would have been funny if her twin sister got acting work after t2
[01:11] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and gone on to do great stuff
[01:11] <@Tigger_> I wonder what her sister looks like these days
[01:12] <@SoleilMoonFrye> cameron got so lucky 
[01:12] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that was almost like the planets aligned for him 
[01:12] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he probably wrote something to do with a twin the moment he cast her in terminator 
[01:13] <@Tigger_> it was his skill in being able to make T1 on a low budget, and make it look like it cost 10x as much
[01:13] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[01:13] <@SoleilMoonFrye> t1 has some excellent moments visually
[01:13] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the ending jumps the shark a bit
[01:13] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but he did his best
[01:13] <@SoleilMoonFrye> t2 impresses me much more though
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[01:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> have you listened to his commentary for t2?
[01:14] <@Tigger_> T2 gave it all substance
[01:14] <@Tigger_> no
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[01:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that's a crazy commentary
[01:14] <@Tigger_> there is a major shark jumping moment in T2 though:  black programmer
[01:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> nah the black programmer was smart
[01:14] <@Tigger_> no such thing
[01:14] <@Tigger_> may as well have said an elf designed skynet
[01:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> HAHAHA
[01:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> miles dyson
[01:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i didn't like how miles just changed his tune
[01:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and was suddenly all "yeah let's destroy it"
[01:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i find that hard to believe
[01:16] <@SoleilMoonFrye> meeting arnold schwarzeneggar and then realising that he is actually a robot wouldn't have come as a big suprise to me
[01:16] <@SoleilMoonFrye> especially after viewing many of his films
[01:16] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i'm suprised dyson was so shocked
[01:17] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i'd be like, "ah yeah predator was a bit strange, it all makes sense now!"
[01:17] <@Tigger_> I am hoping that Arnie does become president one day, so then muslims who think the Terminator films are real will think the US President is a killer robot coming to get them
[01:17] <@SoleilMoonFrye> arnold can not ever be a president
[01:18] <@Tigger_> not currently
[01:18] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he's not US born
[01:18] <@Tigger_> that law was only introduced in the 1950s
[01:18] * cocksmith_n_weston (~err@512d9add.dodo.com.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
[01:18] <@SoleilMoonFrye> were there NON usa presidents before 1950 though?
[01:18] <@Tigger_> there were a few born in England way back, I think
[01:19] <@SoleilMoonFrye> interesting
[01:19] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i doubt they'll ever change that though now
[01:19] <@SoleilMoonFrye> terminator is not terminator without arnold
[01:19] <@Ethanol> they made an exception for Obama ;)
[01:19] <@Tigger_> if the rumours are true that Obama was born outside the US, in Kenya, then he's illegally the president
[01:20] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it was strange at the end of T4 with that terminator that looked a lot like arnold
[01:20] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i don't know why they did that
[01:21] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i thought they were trying to distance themselves from him and the terminator world
[01:21] <@Tigger_> I thought John Connor was going to send whatshisname back in time
[01:21] <+xm> well george washington technically wasnt born in america
[01:21] <+xm> as the USA didnt exist then
[01:21] <@SoleilMoonFrye> send kyle back in time?
[01:21] <@Tigger_> yeah
[01:21] <@Tigger_> good point xm
[01:21] <@SoleilMoonFrye> not sure what even happened with kyle
[01:21] <@SoleilMoonFrye> did kyle die in this one?
[01:22] <@SoleilMoonFrye> or just run away
[01:22] <@Tigger_> I forget
[01:22] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it was shit
[01:22] <@Ethanol> his mute companion survived
[01:22] <@SoleilMoonFrye> T3 was better
[01:22] <@SoleilMoonFrye> T3 was just a simple variation
[01:22] <@Tigger_> the mute black girl who had no reason to be in the film at all, except to have a token nigger
[01:23] <@Ethanol> oh it was a girl?
[01:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i liked the bit where the got the gizmo to work which would bring the spacecrafts down
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[01:23] <@Tigger_> hard to tell, I assume a girl
[01:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but then they just discarded that 
[01:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> god it was such a shit film
[01:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> christian bale is just a whore now
[01:23] <@Tigger_> he is a great Batman though
[01:24] <@Ethanol> T3 had better women
[01:24] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he's a fucking boring batman
[01:24] <@Ethanol> the women in T4 were monkeys
[01:24] <@SoleilMoonFrye> michael keaton was so much better
[01:24] <@Tigger_> michael keaton was a great batman, not as good at being Bruce Wayne though
[01:25] <@Tigger_> I only remember this asian looking female with the ridiculous name 'Blood Moongold' or something
[01:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> ummm
[01:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> bale is a shit wayne
[01:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> totally wooden
[01:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he could be so much more of a smart ass
[01:26] <@Tigger_> I love wooden acting
[01:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> his "batman" voice is totally laughable
[01:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> keaton was pretty wooden too though i guess
[01:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> keaton was a little more classy i think
[01:27] <@SoleilMoonFrye> heath ledger's scenes were what made that film
[01:27] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the rest is quite shitty
[01:27] <@SoleilMoonFrye> just seems like it was all written around those scenes with heath
[01:28] <@Tigger_> dark knight is a masterpiece
[01:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> gary oldman is totally wasted in his role
[01:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> maggie gyllenhaal was useless
[01:28] <@Tigger_> oh she's horrid
[01:28] <@Tigger_> so ugly
[01:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> morgan freeman was lame
[01:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the two face plot should have been the whole film
[01:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> with ledger
[01:29] <@Tigger_> morgan was the token negro
[01:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it started so well
[01:29] <@Tigger_> yes
[01:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> with a loving ode to michael mann's skills
[01:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and then went down hill
[01:30] <@Tigger_> will you buy Heat on bluray?
[01:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> no
[01:30] <@Tigger_> why not?
[01:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> because i'll wait for the next format
[01:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> which will just be digital downloads
[01:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but i don't see the point in purchasing a physical item
[01:30] <@Tigger_> we have that now, but it's free
[01:31] <@SoleilMoonFrye> because physical purchases will be phased out in the next 10 yrs
[01:31] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it won't be called Blu ray
[01:31] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it'll just be HD 
[01:31] <@SoleilMoonFrye> download
[01:31] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i've seen heat enough times to not be able to sit through it
[01:32] <@Tigger_> I think bigpond has HD downloads now for sale
[01:32] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i watched Eyes wide shut the other month and got quite annoyed with the slow pace
[01:32] <@SoleilMoonFrye> some of those scenes take 5 minutes to happen
[01:32] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and nothing much happens
[01:32] <@SoleilMoonFrye> tom and nicole just hanging around in their apartment
[01:33] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and the constant tom cruise imagining nicole having sex with another man became really lame
[01:33] <@SoleilMoonFrye> did you notice that?
[01:33] <@Tigger_> EWS is great
[01:34] <@SoleilMoonFrye> scorcese has commented that he thinks it's one of the best films ever made
[01:34] <@Tigger_> so he should
[01:34] <@SoleilMoonFrye> such lengthy exposition was not required
[01:34] <@SoleilMoonFrye> kubrick should have cut it down by 20 or 30 mins
[01:35] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it would have been a lot more enjoyable that way
[01:35] <+PrometheanStardust> They should have added a 20 minute scene of Tom Cruise being crucified
[01:35] <@Tigger_> I think all films should be at that pace
[01:35] <@SoleilMoonFrye> cruise really needs to start making good films again
[01:35] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he can be a very effective actor
[01:36] <@SoleilMoonFrye> his acting is very good in EWS though
[01:37] <@SoleilMoonFrye> there was a lot of media dicussion that cruise and kidman railroaded kubrick
[01:37] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and called a lot of shots on the film
[01:37] <@SoleilMoonFrye> which is such bullshit
[01:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> films like EWS, taxi driver, raging bull, goodfellas.. etc are very enjoyable
[01:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> stand alone films
[01:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that will never get fucked over by people trying to turn them into franchises
[01:40] <@Tigger_> Kubrick takes orders from no one
[01:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yes
[01:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> kubrick was a hard man
[01:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's a shame he died
[01:41] <+PrometheanStardust> He should have refused to go
[01:41] <+retard> hes not dead, just resting
[01:41] <+retard> props tho
[01:41] <+PrometheanStardust> props to Stanley Kubrick
[01:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> there's only a few good ones left
[01:41] <+retard> kubrick is having a lie down
[01:41] <+PrometheanStardust> lol
[01:41] <+retard> lololol
[01:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> michael mann, coppola, scorcese(occasionally)
[01:42] <@Tigger_> Mann is no longer good
[01:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> mann is still good
[01:42] <@Tigger_> Coppola shames himself nowdays
[01:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> mann has done such good he deserves respect forever
[01:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> Heat is a true film of brilliance
[01:42] <@Tigger_> Mann reduced himself to making Ali G episodes
[01:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> nothing compares to heat
[01:42] <@Tigger_> Heat is a remake btw
[01:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> lol
[01:43] <@SoleilMoonFrye> no it isnt
[01:43] <@Tigger_> yes it IS
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[01:43] <@SoleilMoonFrye> how do you come to such a determination?
[01:43] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's an original screenplay
[01:43] <@Tigger_> it is a remake of Mann's own TV movie, also called 'Heat'
[01:44] <@SoleilMoonFrye> ah no
[01:44] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that was a pilot 
[01:44] <@SoleilMoonFrye> wasn't it?
[01:44] <@Tigger_> not sure
[01:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hahaha
[01:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it was HIS tv pilot
[01:45] <@Tigger_> still a remake
[01:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> so no, no dice.
[01:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> As a remake of his TV pilot L.A. Takedown, Heat is a mercurial exercise in cinematic form, shifting between the poles of elaborately choreographed action set-pieces to the long-lensed, tightly focused, intimate exchanges between couples. Personal dramas are played out in glass-walled houses, overlooking the sea or against the abstracted backdrops of flickering lights in cityscapes. Three action sequences structure the film - an ambu
[01:46] <@SoleilMoonFrye> end must view heat
[01:46] <@SoleilMoonFrye> to see the best film ever made.
[01:46] <@Tigger_> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L.A._Takedown oh here it is, not called Heat
[01:47] <@SoleilMoonFrye> Whereas LA Takedown was produced in just a month, with 10 days on pre-production and 19 days of shooting, Heat took over 9 months to produce, with six months of pre-production and 107 days of shooting. Takedown was also made on a low budget, while the budget of Heat is estimated at over $50 million.
[01:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> It doesn't matter though because he produced both
[01:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> It's not like he took someone else's concept
[01:48] <@Tigger_> I will always regard LA Takedown as the authentic, true Heat
[01:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> So he is one of the very few to retain cred.
[01:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> I've never seen LA takedown
[01:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i think i shall leech it
[01:48] <@Tigger_> neither have I
[01:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> we should view it
[01:49] <@SoleilMoonFrye> actually part of me doesn't want to view it
[01:49] <@Tigger_> I will get the bluray rip of Heat
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[01:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and we shall not have the pleasure to view LA takedown anyway
[01:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it is not available on torrents
[01:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and i'm sure it is bad.
[01:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> "Heat took over 9 months to produce, with six months of pre-production and 107 days of shooting. "
[01:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that's a big journey
[01:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> post production would have been long
[01:51] <+PrometheanStardust> Natalie went to Comic-Con in The US
[01:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> did you know that the whole city shootout in that film was done using the on set audio, Tigger_?
[01:51] <@Tigger_> my favourite story about Heat is that Mann used the sound of real gunfire
[01:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> highly rare 
[01:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> ah
[01:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> there ya go
[01:52] <@Tigger_> he liked the way the sound would echo around the buildings
[01:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> on the dvd i have the bonus features show deniro shooting on a target range
[01:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and doing training
[01:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> with real guns
[01:52] <@Tigger_> it wasn't originally meant to be like this, but when he heard the rubbish stock audio gunfire he demanded it be removed
[01:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> shooting real targets whilst running and dodging obstacles
[01:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> extremely cool footage
[01:52] <@Tigger_> that was the last time DeNiro was cool
[01:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yes
[01:53] <@SoleilMoonFrye> very true
[01:53] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it makes me wonder why deniro AND pacino stopped making good films straight after Heat
[01:53] <+retard> if kubrick were alive he would make a curry hunting movie
[01:53] <@SoleilMoonFrye> in fact pretty much all the cast 
[01:53] <+PrometheanStardust> Gayest movie of 2010 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjMkNrX60mA
[01:53] <+retard> props
[01:53] <@Tigger_> I've downloaded a fair number of 'professiona' movie sound effects CDs, and I thought they were all terrible, and anybody could do a better job
[01:53] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yes
[01:54] <@SoleilMoonFrye> you can't "trigger" sounds
[01:54] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and have them sound right
[01:54] <@Tigger_> they were just really flat and uninteresting sounds
[01:54] <@Tigger_> no punch to them
[01:55] <@SoleilMoonFrye> just the skill alone audio wise on the recording of that shootout is really impressive. especially the fact that they were planning to foley in the sound later
[01:55] <@SoleilMoonFrye> they could have done a real loose audio job on it
[01:55] <@SoleilMoonFrye> with the intention of replacing it all
[01:55] <@SoleilMoonFrye> one of the best action scenes of all time
[01:56] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's essentially real
[01:56] <@SoleilMoonFrye> when you watch it
[01:56] <@Tigger_> I must confess this is true
[01:56] <@SoleilMoonFrye> pacino taking the kill shot on the guy holding the kid is class
[01:56] <@SoleilMoonFrye> a great visual moment
[01:56] <@Tigger_> yes
[01:57] <@SoleilMoonFrye> if only deniro had just drove to the airport
[01:57] <@SoleilMoonFrye> to head off to NZ
[01:57] <@Tigger_> and Pacino and Deniro had their first scene together
[01:57] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yes
[01:58] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that scene is by far the best movie moment i've ever witnessed
[01:58] <@Tigger_> they didn't kiss though
[01:58] <@SoleilMoonFrye> in the commentary he says they filmed it about 5 times i think
[01:58] <@SoleilMoonFrye> heh
[01:58] <@Tigger_> only 5 times?
[01:58] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and the 4th take was the one
[01:58] <@SoleilMoonFrye> straight through
[01:59] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he would have had them rehearse it about 100 times probably
[02:00] <@SoleilMoonFrye> mann directed those 2 better than any director could have
[02:00] <@SoleilMoonFrye> scorcese would have been lost trying to do that film
[02:01] <@SoleilMoonFrye> Will you agree that it is the greatest film ever made, Tigger_?
[02:01] <@Tigger_> they could've made it a committee of directors, Scorsese could've directed Deniro, Coppolla could've directed Pacino, Kubrick could've directed the cameras, and Mann could've directed the coffee
[02:01] <@Tigger_> no
[02:01] <@SoleilMoonFrye> lol
[02:01] <@Tigger_> Heat is not to be found amongst my favourite 10 films ever
[02:01] <@SoleilMoonFrye> very dissapointing
[02:01] <@Tigger_> so much competition though
[02:02] <@SoleilMoonFrye> not really
[02:02] <@SoleilMoonFrye> name a better film
[02:02] <@Tigger_> Stalker
[02:02] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i have not seen it
[02:02] <@Tigger_> Passion of Joan of Arc
[02:02] <@Tigger_> Vertigo
[02:03] <@SoleilMoonFrye> different kinds of movies
[02:03] <@Tigger_> Hitchcock could've done a better job directing Heat
[02:03] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i doubt that
[02:04] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hitchcock didn't get realistic performances
[02:04] <@Tigger_> in fact Mann should've held regular seances in order to consult Hitchcock
[02:04] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hahaha
[02:04] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hitchcock hammed it up
[02:04] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but rear window was very, very good i guess
[02:04] <@Tigger_> it was
[02:04] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that era of hitchcock was much more understated
[02:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i prefer it
[02:05] <@Tigger_> would've been good to have Bruce Campbell in Heat too
[02:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hitchcock had great skills at making very unnerving scenes
[02:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and paranoia
[02:06] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i'd love to see how he worked with his actors
[02:06] <@SoleilMoonFrye> what kind of direction he gave
[02:06] <@Tigger_> he played mind games with them, and caused them to have mental breakdowns
[02:06] <@SoleilMoonFrye> if he told them exactly what to do or gave them room to come up with interpretations
[02:06] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i imagine it wouldn't have been the latter
[02:06] <@Tigger_> they did what they were told
[02:06] <@Tigger_> he famously said 'actors should be treated like cattle'
[02:08] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yes
[02:08] <@SoleilMoonFrye> if i was a director i would be telling them exactly what to do
[02:09] <@SoleilMoonFrye> a movie should be made about hitchcock
[02:09] <@Tigger_> they need to be shouted at
[02:11] <@SoleilMoonFrye> if only steven spielberg had a bit of hitchcock in him
[02:12] <@SoleilMoonFrye> alas he just seems to want to make films about the holocaust
[02:12] <@Tigger_> Spielberg is too busy trying to make statements
[02:12] <@SoleilMoonFrye> had spielberg done anything since war of the holocaust?
[02:12] <@Tigger_> Minority Report is his best film since Raiders of the Lost Ark
[02:12] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yes
[02:12] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i enjoy minority report
[02:13] <@Tigger_> will be excellent to have it on bluray
[02:13] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i think george lucas' best film is THX
[02:13] <@Tigger_> it's a bad film, but it has incredible production values for a low budget
[02:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> those star wars films were really silly
[02:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[02:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the story makes no sense
[02:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but it looks so good
[02:14] <@Tigger_> I just wish he didn't ruin it by having a special edition with his CGI inserts
[02:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and the documentary is BRILLIANT 
[02:14] <@Tigger_> yes, the documentary was highly informative
[02:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that zoetrope gang were quite cool back then
[02:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> thank god lucas didn't get his hands on apocalypse
[02:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> jesus christ that would have been horrific
[02:14] <@Tigger_> Han Solo was based on Coppola, the huge risk taker
[02:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> nice
[02:15] <@Tigger_> Apocalypse Now was his idea
[02:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[02:15] <@Tigger_> and he was a bit annoyed that Coppola went and did it without him
[02:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's scary to think he was slated to make it for a while
[02:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> imagine it if lucas had done it
[02:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> makes me shudder
[02:16] <@Tigger_> one can only imagine
[02:16] <@Tigger_> I think it would've been more like THX, a lot of great looking scenes with an incoherent story
[02:16] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[02:17] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i dunno how he pulled it off
[02:17] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the visuals in thx
[02:17] <@SoleilMoonFrye> even just those big white rooms
[02:17] <@SoleilMoonFrye> they're seamless
[02:17] <@Tigger_> of course Apocalypse Now is somewhat incoherent, but it works in the context, like Marlon Brando dispensing his wisdom like a burned out hippy
[02:17] <@SoleilMoonFrye> brando was good
[02:18] <@SoleilMoonFrye> against all odds
[02:18] <@Tigger_> I really want to see an untouched version of THX, as I've only seen the Lucas director's cut, which inserts new effects, so I don't know what's authentic and what isn't
[02:18] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's funny that the film was about the lawless vibe of that time in history and the story of the making of the movie is essentially the same thing
[02:19] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah lucas had to get his fucking modern digital shit and go ahead and tear it apart
[02:19] <@Tigger_> years of shooting
[02:19] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he's such a weirdo in that regard
[02:20] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he'll go further with it too
[02:20] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he'll keep doing it on any re-issue of those films
[02:20] <@Tigger_> I'd also like to get rid of the Redux cut, go back to the original theatrical cut
[02:20] <@Tigger_> yes
[02:20] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he'll still be fucking around with star wars in 10 yrs time
[02:21] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he's gone and set a precident for other directors too with that ideal
[02:21] <@Tigger_> terrible
[02:21] <@SoleilMoonFrye> next thing we'll have fincher re-making alien 3
[02:22] <@Tigger_> I generally really hate director's cuts, with some exceptions, like the Exorcist director's cut had good new stuff
[02:22] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[02:22] <@SoleilMoonFrye> some of redux was cool
[02:22] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but a lot was bad news
[02:22] <@Tigger_> it had one good cool shot, the US base destroyed by a cyclone
[02:22] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he should have just remastered it and fixed the picture
[02:22] <@Tigger_> the rest of it was too much fat
[02:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> with redux as a second disc
[02:23] <@Tigger_> and that endless discussion at the French plantation
[02:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the french bit was tragic
[02:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and the hustler girls
[02:23] <@Tigger_> yes
[02:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> in the helicopters
[02:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> god
[02:24] <@SoleilMoonFrye> so bad
[02:24] <@SoleilMoonFrye> can't believe he even bothered to spend the weeks and weeks it would have taken to shoot that originally
[02:24] <@Tigger_> it was really just to bring in some money for his Megapolis project, which sank anyway
[02:24] <@SoleilMoonFrye> weird stuff
[02:25] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it must have cost a lot of money to make redux
[02:25] <@SoleilMoonFrye> especially re-mixing ALL the audio from the masters
[02:25] <@Tigger_> they'd probably give him money to make Godfather 4
[02:25] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he could have any budget he wants 
[02:25] <@SoleilMoonFrye> if he was going to do that
[02:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he could probably get it financed privately it's so popular
[02:26] <@Tigger_> yes
[02:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> which would be even worse
[02:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> because he'd just go ahead and make a 4 hour film that is fucked
[02:27] <@SoleilMoonFrye> 3 was so bad 
[02:27] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i'd love to know how much pacino got paid for that
[02:27] <@SoleilMoonFrye> probably 15 or 20 million
[02:27] <@Tigger_> it was pretty funny when a mob hit is done via helicopter mounted machine gun
[02:27] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that's the best scene
[02:27] <@SoleilMoonFrye> casting his idiot daughter was a great mistake
[02:28] <@Tigger_> I'm pretty sure they don't do that in real life
[02:28] <@Tigger_> oh yeah, big nosed Sophia Coppola
[02:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> she has sex with her cousin or something in it
[02:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> great writing
[02:28] <@Tigger_> she has?
[02:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[02:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> what's his name is her cousin
[02:28] <@Tigger_> oh right, I forgot that
[02:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> in the story
[02:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's silly
[02:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> worst film, ever.
[02:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> bet you in a few years the godfather will be remade
[02:30] <@Tigger_> the plot by P2 to assassinate the Pope was quite interesting in light of what happened to Pope John Paul 1 though
[02:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> with christian bale as the title role
[02:30] <@Tigger_> everything gets remade
[02:30] * PrometheanStardust (~Prom@188c10f1.tpgi.com.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
[02:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> films of that calibre should never be remade
[02:31] <@Tigger_> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetro  looks like he has a new film out
[02:32] <@SoleilMoonFrye> Richard Corliss of TIME Magazine gave the film a mixed review praising Ehrenreich's performance, but claiming Coppola "has made a movie in which plenty happens but nothing rings true."
[02:32] <@SoleilMoonFrye> lol
[02:33] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i think i'll view that
[02:33] <@Tigger_> heh
[02:33] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i'm sure it will be visually wonderful
[02:33] <@Tigger_> I've seen the bluray rip of this about:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Youth_Without_Youth_(film)
[02:33] <@Tigger_> The film was shot with a Sony HDC-F900 in High Definition
[02:33] <@Tigger_> Coppola is a convert to digital now too
[02:34] <@SoleilMoonFrye> ah
[02:34] <@SoleilMoonFrye> "The film was shot with a Sony HDC-F900 in High Definition and edited on Final Cut Pro 5."
[02:34] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that is a red flag.
[02:34] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hahaha
[02:34] <@Tigger_> not a fan of that camera though
[02:34] <@SoleilMoonFrye> god 
[02:34] <@SoleilMoonFrye> just like mann, coppola should not be going to digital
[02:34] <@SoleilMoonFrye> these guys are defined by film
[02:35] <@Tigger_> it's the same camera that Lucas used for Attack of the Clones
[02:35] * PrometheanStardust (~Prom@188c10f1.tpgi.com.au) has joined #politicaldebate
[02:35] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i doubt it will look like attack of the clones
[02:35] <@SoleilMoonFrye> what lucas did with digital on that film was brilliant
[02:35] <@Tigger_> Lucas used a beta version of the camera on that
[02:35] <@SoleilMoonFrye> was it good ?
[02:36] <@Tigger_> which is why it's so grainy
[02:36] <@SoleilMoonFrye> youth without youth
[02:36] <@Tigger_> not downloaded it yet
[02:36] <@SoleilMoonFrye> grain is important
[02:36] <@SoleilMoonFrye> lucas was smart
[02:36] <@SoleilMoonFrye> even if it's synthetic
[02:36] <@Tigger_> it looks stupid:
[02:36] <@SoleilMoonFrye> crystal clear HD destroys depth
[02:37] <@Tigger_> As he is walking down a street he is struck by a bolt of lightning which gives him third degree burns. He is taken to a hospital where he heals into a young man with supernatural powers (which he discovers as his life progresses).
[02:37] <@Tigger_> He is helped out of the hospital by the doctor who nurses him. He publishes about his remarkable recovery and it arouses the interests of the Nazis. They send over a female spy who seduces him and talks with him in various languages. Apparently Dominic has a talent for learning languages in his sleep. He also suffers from a split personality and converses with his split partner.
[02:37] <@SoleilMoonFrye> my friend has an HD plasma and when i go watch movies on it i'm shocked
[02:37] <@Tigger_> depth comes from the lenses you use
[02:37] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it just looks so bad
[02:37] <@SoleilMoonFrye> like crap
[02:37] <@SoleilMoonFrye> like cheap, cold digital
[02:37] <@Tigger_> what movie did you watch on it?
[02:38] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i've watched many
[02:38] <@SoleilMoonFrye> watched a lot of 24
[02:38] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the tv show
[02:38] <@SoleilMoonFrye> which is a big budget
[02:38] <@Tigger_> don't know what that is shot on
[02:38] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that looks terrible
[02:38] <@SoleilMoonFrye> looks fine on my standard crt tv
[02:38] <@Tigger_> what brand is his plasma?
[02:38] <@SoleilMoonFrye> panasonic
[02:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's a $2,500 plasma
[02:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> 40 inch
[02:39] <@Tigger_> The only way to survive Youth Without Youth is dead drunk. The least Mr Coppola could do is provide free Cabernet Sauvignon from his own vineyards. One bottle going in, another bottle staggering out."
[02:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> everything looks bad on it
[02:39] <@Tigger_> LOL
[02:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hahaha
[02:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that is gold!
[02:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i like creative criticism
[02:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i think everyone should chill with digital for another 5-10 yrs
[02:40] <@Tigger_> that was his first movie in 10 years too
[02:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> until the grading is better
[02:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah i wouldn't be expecting anything good from coppola ever
[02:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> especially after that matt damon thing
[02:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> rainmaker
[02:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> god
[02:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> no
[02:41] <@Tigger_> my plan is to get an LCD projector, but I'm not 100% confident in the technology right now
[02:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> wtf was he thinking
[02:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> well i'm very interested in seeing Avatar 
[02:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i'm expecting great visual things 
[02:41] <@Tigger_> if it has friendly aliens I'm walking out
[02:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i still think cameron should have done it on film though
[02:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> which is impossible
[02:41] <@Tigger_> what's he shooting it on?
[02:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but it would have been good
[02:42] <+PrometheanStardust> wtf
[02:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's all digital
[02:42] <+PrometheanStardust> I'm trying to register on piratebay
[02:42] <+PrometheanStardust> It keeps saying 'wrong code'
[02:42] <+PrometheanStardust> Even though I keep typing them in correctly
[02:42] <@Tigger_> piratebay has been a bit crippled lately
[02:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> we should be able to find the camera he is using
[02:42] <@Tigger_> broken captcha
[02:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> After a string of landmark feature films, Cameron turned his focus to documentary filmmaking and the co-development of the digital 3-D Fusion Camera System.
[02:43] <@SoleilMoonFrye> There is a video  about the Fusion system presented at NAB 2007 as the "Sony Fusion 3D Camera System". This is also referred to as the Pace-Fusion and Pace-Cameron system (they do credit collaboration with James Cameron). It uses two Sony HDCF950 HD cameras, which are presumably variants of the Sony CineAlta range.
[02:43] <@Tigger_> Cameron was announced to be using his own Reality Camera System to film in 3-D. The system would use two high-definition cameras in a single camera body to create depth perception.
[02:44] <@Tigger_> Red have a 3D Scarlet with two cameras mounted into one rig
[02:44] <@SoleilMoonFrye> interesting
[02:44] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the key is what cameron does in post to grade his footage
[02:44] <@SoleilMoonFrye> which i'm sure no one will be privvy to
[02:44] <@Tigger_> but Cameron should stay away from the Sony cameras, they're lame
[02:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i hope cameron is looking for a super sharp image
[02:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> isnt
[02:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he loves film though
[02:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> so i'm sure he'll try and dumb the image down a bit
[02:45] <@Tigger_> Cameron has always been a bit weird with his shooting style though, like he prefers using grainy Super 35mm over getting an anamorphic widescreen lense.  he even did this for Titanic
[02:46] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he understands depth
[02:46] <@SoleilMoonFrye> which is what shits me about michael mann
[02:46] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he should be staying with the winning formula
[02:46] <@SoleilMoonFrye> half the audience doesn't even notice the difference though
[02:46] <@Tigger_> I do
[02:46] <@SoleilMoonFrye> which is pretty funny
[02:46] <@SoleilMoonFrye> you aren't in the dumb half of the audience though
[02:47] <@Tigger_> I think 90% of the audience if stopped in the lobby on the way out couldn't tell you if the film was widescreen or not
[02:47] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[02:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> if everyone could use digital like how it was used in the benjamin button film we wouldn't even need to have this discussion
[02:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that's just total perfection
[02:48] <@Tigger_> Fincher was using the Viper filmstream cameras, Mann uses them too but not as well
[02:49] <@SoleilMoonFrye> mann makes a point of not lighting it well when he uses digital
[02:49] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he wants people to notice the difference
[02:49] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he never makes "full" digital films either
[02:49] <@SoleilMoonFrye> there's always 30% film sort of thing
[02:49] <@SoleilMoonFrye> or more
[02:49] <@Tigger_> why not?
[02:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> collateral still had many scenes shot on film
[02:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> mixed 
[02:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he chose the scenes 
[02:50] <@Tigger_> the daylight scenes were shot on film
[02:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> especially scenes with LA skyline
[02:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he shot on digital
[02:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[02:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i found it really annoying
[02:50] <@Tigger_> he used the cine alta because light doesn't fall off so quickly into the background
[02:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i'd start enjoying the film footage and then it would snap to digital
[02:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it was very jarring
[02:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> felt like all the digital scenes were picked up after principal shooting or something
[02:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and rushed
[02:51] <@Tigger_> it does look shocking
[02:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> which they werent
[02:51] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but it sucked
[02:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> miami vice was a lot more digital from what i recall
[02:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> less film
[02:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> really, really bad
[02:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> a shithouse film
[02:52] <@Tigger_> there is something I find worse though, movies shot on film, that are deliberately made to look like they were shot on a VHS handicam, like Terminator Salvation
[02:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[02:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that's harder for me to fault
[02:53] <@SoleilMoonFrye> because it's still film
[02:53] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but very shaky
[02:53] <@Tigger_> Like Collateral, which also starred Foxx, most of the film was shot with the Thomson Viper Filmstream Camera, and the remainder was shot on Super 35mm film. Cinematographer Dion Beebe was also the cinematographer of Collateral.[4]
[02:53] <@SoleilMoonFrye> t4 had some weird film processing shit going on
[02:53] <@SoleilMoonFrye> mann screws digital up
[02:54] <@SoleilMoonFrye> deliberatly bad lighting
[02:54] <@Tigger_> the only answer is that Mann either doesn't know how to use the cameras properly, or simply prefers the nasty look
[02:54] <@Tigger_> since Fincher does a much better job with the same camera
[02:54] <@SoleilMoonFrye> mann is an obsessive kind of guy
[02:54] <@SoleilMoonFrye> anything he uses he will know backwards
[02:54] <@SoleilMoonFrye> so anything you see or hear is totally intentional
[02:55] <@Tigger_> and using Super 35?  that's a bit yuck, he ought to have used anamorphic 35
[02:55] <@SoleilMoonFrye> fincher is a very classy guy though
[02:55] <+PrometheanStardust> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sG1c7dfLneM
[02:55] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i'd still prefer it if everyone would just go back to film
[02:55] <+PrometheanStardust> Grey's Anatomy on Wii
[02:56] <@Tigger_> <@SoleilMoonFrye> i'd still prefer it if everyone would just go back to film  <- lamont would be shouting "Hear! Hear!"
[02:56] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hehe
[02:57] <@SoleilMoonFrye> anyone thinking of using digital for big budget films should be just trying to get lucas' or fincher's crew involved
[02:58] <@Tigger_> there's only one thing that particularly impressed me with the Cine Alta, and that was it made Russian Ark possible to shoot
[02:59] <@SoleilMoonFrye> Russian Ark was recorded in uncompressed high definition video using a Sony HDW-F900. The information was recorded uncompressed onto a hard disk which could hold 100 minutes, thus allowing the entire film to be shot in a single 90 minute take. Four attempts were made to complete the shot; the first three had to be interrupted due to technical faults, but the fourth attempt was completed successfully. Extra material on the DVD releas
[02:59] <@Tigger_> yep
[02:59] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that is very interesting
[02:59] <@Tigger_> it's a great film too
[03:00] <@SoleilMoonFrye> a single 90 minute take?
[03:00] <@Tigger_> yes
[03:00] <@Tigger_> I have the dvd of it
[03:00] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that doesn't mean the whole film is one take on one day though does it?
[03:00] <@Tigger_> yes it was
[03:00] <@SoleilMoonFrye> how is that possible?
[03:00] <@Tigger_> very good organisation
[03:00] <@SoleilMoonFrye> where is the film set
[03:00] <@Tigger_> heaps happens in the film too
[03:01] <@Tigger_> it's set in the St Petersberg Hermitage Museum
[03:01] <@Tigger_> and two guys walk from room to room, and each one is a different time period
[03:02] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that is ridiculous
[03:02] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i have to see this film
[03:02] <@Tigger_> yes you must
[03:02] <@Tigger_> I've seen it a few times
[03:02] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i shall leech it now
[03:02] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i know
[03:02] <@Tigger_> it has about 3000 people in the cast too
[03:02] <@SoleilMoonFrye> you've been mentioning it for a couple years
[03:03] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's leeching now
[03:03] <@Tigger_> if just one of them tripped over, or sneezed at the wrong time, it'd ruin everything
[03:03] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i can't imagine it working
[03:03] <@SoleilMoonFrye> sound wise too
[03:03] <@SoleilMoonFrye> they probably did the sound later though
[03:04] <@Tigger_> I imagine the main mic was on the camera
[03:04] <@Tigger_> apparently the cinematographer did his back in
[03:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> so it's just like documented theatre
[03:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> very interesting
[03:06] <@SoleilMoonFrye> The film displays 33 rooms of the museum, which are filled with a cast of over 2,000 actors.
[03:06] <@Tigger_> ah, 2000
[03:07] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i can't imagine the acting being decent throughout
[03:07] <@Tigger_> it is
[03:07] <@SoleilMoonFrye> so many variables
[03:07] <@SoleilMoonFrye> as a director though
[03:07] <@SoleilMoonFrye> you'd be picking it apart
[03:07] <@Tigger_> no film will ever be done like this again though
[03:07] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the director must have been able to let a lot go
[03:08] <@SoleilMoonFrye> acting wise
[03:08] <@SoleilMoonFrye> just the focus on the technical side alone would have been staggering
[03:08] <@Tigger_> watch it and see
[03:09] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the director was probably in the cameraman's ear 
[03:09] <@SoleilMoonFrye> in real time
[03:09] <@Tigger_> probably
[03:09] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it will be downloaded in 4 hours
[03:09] * PrometheanStardust (~Prom@188c10f1.tpgi.com.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
[03:10] <@Tigger_> looking forwards to a bluray of that
[03:10] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[03:10] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the doco would be great
[03:10] <@SoleilMoonFrye> so the sound is on set?
[03:11] <@Tigger_> I don't fully know how live the sound is, some surely is
[03:11] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i wonder if the dialogue is
[03:11] <@Tigger_> there is an orchestra playing in the ball room scene
[03:11] <@SoleilMoonFrye> you'd wanna put that in later
[03:11] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the camera must have been pretty lightweight
[03:11] <@Tigger_> there were probably mics hidden in each room too
[03:12] * PrometheanStardust (~Prom@188c10f1.tpgi.com.au) has joined #politicaldebate
[03:12] <@SoleilMoonFrye> how much does this Sony HDW-F900 cost
[03:12] <@SoleilMoonFrye> 50k or something?
[03:13] <@Tigger_> 100k
[03:13] <@Tigger_> oh actually, about 200k for a proper rig
[03:13] <@Tigger_> not worth it at all though
[03:13] <@Tigger_> Red One is far superior in every way
[03:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> pretty decent though by the sound of it
[03:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that's a lot of money
[03:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> for something digital
[03:14] <@Tigger_> it was ok for its time, but Red is where the action is today
[03:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> http://www.broadcaststore.com/store/model_detail.cfm?id=20640
[03:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> looks very nice
[03:14] <@SoleilMoonFrye> you wouldn't wanna drop thaty
[03:15] <@Tigger_> the real cost of the HDW-9xx's is the tape transport mechanism rather than the camera itself, as high bandwidth digital tape mechanisms are incredibly expensive
[03:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> interesting how the body is just nothing
[03:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> just like any kind of camera
[03:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> tiny
[03:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> wonder how much the tapes cost
[03:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> must be quite expensive
[03:15] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hundreds of dollars
[03:15] <@Tigger_> the Scarlet base unit isn't much bigger than a largish SLR camera
[03:16] <@SoleilMoonFrye> oh it's just a hard drive isnt it
[03:16] <@Tigger_> I did look into rental of the cine alta once, it was $30k per month
[03:16] <@SoleilMoonFrye> wow
[03:16] <@Tigger_> that's AU
[03:16] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the maintanence is probably really expensive 
[03:16] <@Tigger_> well tape drives can break down easily
[03:17] <@Tigger_> as for Red, never heard of one breaking down, but it doesn't use tape
[03:17] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[03:17] <@SoleilMoonFrye> loading a 1tb drive would be very cool
[03:18] <@SoleilMoonFrye> wonder how much footage you'd get out of 1tb
[03:18] <@Tigger_> most commonly they use 300gb 2.5" drives
[03:18] <@SoleilMoonFrye> you could run drives external though couldn't you?
[03:18] <@Tigger_> it's about 1Gb a minute, though this can go higher depending on the resolution
[03:18] <@Tigger_> yes
[03:18] <@SoleilMoonFrye> 1gb a minute is really good
[03:19] <@Tigger_> you can have a bunch of hard drives in a backpack, and have a cable running around to the camera
[03:19] <@Tigger_> that's pretty much what was done on Russian Ark I think
[03:19] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's understandable why people are interested in it
[03:19] <@SoleilMoonFrye> rather than spend a million on film
[03:20] <@Tigger_> one reel of film stock costs about $5000
[03:20] <@Tigger_> 35mm that is
[03:20] <@SoleilMoonFrye> a reel only lasts 5 minutes doesn't it
[03:20] <@Tigger_> 10 minutes for a full reel
[03:20] <@SoleilMoonFrye> ok
[03:20] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that's not cost effective
[03:20] <@Tigger_> not at all
[03:20] <@SoleilMoonFrye> then the processing would cost so much
[03:21] <@Tigger_> yes
[03:21] <@Tigger_> some people talk about getting film processed in India to save money, but that is quite suicidal
[03:21] <+PrometheanStardust> Is Russian Ark downloadable?
[03:21] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i have a lot of respect for the focus puller
[03:21] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that is an art form
[03:22] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yes i'm leeching it now, end
[03:22] <@Tigger_> you can imagine their grief when the footage comes back all black, then you ring up to complain that they've destroyed your life's work, then they go through a bullet point list with you blaming it all on you
[03:22] <@Tigger_> the focus puller is the hardest job of the lot
[03:22] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hahah
[03:22] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[03:22] <@Tigger_> your grief
[03:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> you never even think about it when you watch a film
[03:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> especially fast paced scenes
[03:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that must be so much pressure
[03:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> http://www.mininova.org/tor/203046
[03:23] <@Tigger_> that's the good thing about digital, a focus puller can make mistakes with it not wasting expensive footage
[03:23] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[03:24] <@SoleilMoonFrye> focus puller should get a category for an oscar
[03:24] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it probably does
[03:24] <@Tigger_> maybe in the minor awards they skip over on TV
[03:24] <@Tigger_> Rocky_Balboa_2006_720p_BluRay_x264-ESiR.mkv 90% complete
[03:25] * [1]camz (~camz@31bc6a6c.pacific.net.au) has joined #politicaldebate
[03:25] <@SoleilMoonFrye> foley artists are another underrated breed
[03:25] <@SoleilMoonFrye> they spend so much time in post on that
[03:25] <@Tigger_> they must be patient
[03:26] <@Tigger_> working on each second as it occurs
[03:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i still watch movies with friends and sometimes comment on how what we are watching is basically silence
[03:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and every part is added in post
[03:26] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and they're just like "no, way"
[03:27] <@Tigger_> yes it very often is, the big budget films often have too much equipment running to get a silent set
[03:27] * PrometheanStardust (~Prom@188c10f1.tpgi.com.au) Quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
[03:27] <@SoleilMoonFrye> well you couldn't do it anyway
[03:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> they always re - do the vocals
[03:28] * camz (camz@210.23.F1E494.82EC5F) Quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
[03:28] * [1]camz is now known as camz
[03:28] <@Tigger_> yes
[03:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> so you'd have to wipe all sound
[03:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> just the vocal looping is incredible on it's on
[03:28] <@SoleilMoonFrye> own
[03:28] <@Tigger_> the films of Sergio Leone even have everyone doing their lines in their own languages, and only in post produce an English language film
[03:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i downloaded a rough edit for an episode of prison break a couple years ago. it was like a leaked rough version. it was so interesting. you could hear all the audio in the rough unmixed format
[03:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> all the vocals were unbalanced
[03:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> all the sound effects kept cutting in and out
[03:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it was a shambles
[03:29] <@Tigger_> I bet it sounded like a lot of amateurs doing a rural theatre production
[03:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> some sections would just cut to silence
[03:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah it sounded like a joke
[03:29] <@SoleilMoonFrye> even the vocals weren't EQ'd properly
[03:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> just sounded like really cheap
[03:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> makes you realise how much time goes into that
[03:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> days and weeks
[03:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> especially depth and room sounds on vocals
[03:30] <@Tigger_> that's why actors should just do their lines and get the expressions right, and not worry too much how they sound
[03:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> different reverbs for different rooms
[03:30] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[03:31] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i don't know how they maintain a consistent feel to it
[03:31] <@SoleilMoonFrye> from episode to episode
[03:31] <@Tigger_> Christopher Nolan's first film 'Following' has live sound throughout, and you can tell, every shuffle, every chair scraping in the background is picked up
[03:31] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it's very smart stuff
[03:32] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[03:32] <@SoleilMoonFrye> following is let down by that
[03:32] <@SoleilMoonFrye> not the best acting either
[03:32] * @Ethanol (~Geoff@81008aeb.internode.on.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
[03:32] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hard to imagine it's the same guy
[03:32] <@Tigger_> I didn't mind it, I thought it was interesting
[03:32] <@SoleilMoonFrye> why is everyone ping timeout in here except us?
[03:32] <@Tigger_> their dialup connections reset
[03:33] <@SoleilMoonFrye> lol
[03:33] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hope not
[03:33] * PrometheanStardust (Prom@188c10f1.tpgi.com.au) has joined #politicaldebate
[03:33] <@SoleilMoonFrye> idle timeout on dialup
[03:33] <@SoleilMoonFrye> classic
[03:35] <@Tigger_> I think the best thing to do in low budget situations is just to mount a microphone on the camera for sake of getting a reference audio track so a new one can be built in post
[03:35] <@Tigger_> it's too insane to try and get a good acoustic environment in low budget films
[03:35] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah i've read many times over the years that they always record room ambiences for like 30 seconds or more of silence on sets
[03:35] <@Tigger_> yes
[03:35] <@Tigger_> and then loop it later
[03:35] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[03:36] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i don't know how they merge that though
[03:36] * camz (~camz@31bc6a6c.pacific.net.au) Quit (Quit:  I love my HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-)
[03:36] <@SoleilMoonFrye> or if they imitate it later
[03:36] <@Tigger_> there is probably a function in the software to do a seemless loop
[03:37] <@SoleilMoonFrye> oh yeah i can create a loop with that in seconds
[03:37] <@Tigger_> good
[03:37] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i just wonder if it's what they actually do
[03:37] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it probably is
[03:37] <@SoleilMoonFrye> just sounds too simple to be true
[03:38] <@Tigger_> it was probably a lot harder before there were software solutions
[03:38] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i've created ambiences like rumbles and stuff
[03:38] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but never used the actual sound
[03:38] <@SoleilMoonFrye> would be good to try it
[03:38] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah i don't know how they did a lot of this stuff before digital
[03:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> especially all the vocal dubbing
[03:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> it must have been such a long process
[03:39] <@Tigger_> I was reading about the specialist who did canned laughter for sitcoms in the 60s, and he did it with a secret box full of analogue individual laugh samples, and with a keyboard created a whole audience of laughter
[03:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> haha
[03:39] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that's great
[03:39] <@Tigger_> the same guy did virtually every 60s sitcom canned laughter
[03:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i met this US comedian a couple years ago and was talking to him about some of the canned laughter on his albums
[03:40] <@Tigger_> so they weren't live albums?
[03:40] <@SoleilMoonFrye> nah
[03:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> they were supposed to be live
[03:41] <@Tigger_> scandalous
[03:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but made to be obviously fake
[03:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> his trade was bad jokes
[03:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but anyway he said he went to Marcel Marceau shows
[03:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> with stereo mini disk recorder setup in a cap
[03:41] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that he worse
[03:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and he recorded the whole show
[03:42] <@Tigger_> lol
[03:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> which was perfect because those shows were silent
[03:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> so you got perfect audience laughter
[03:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> with no voice at the start
[03:42] <@Tigger_> ah
[03:42] <@Tigger_> great idea
[03:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> isn't that brilliant
[03:42] <@Tigger_> hugely
[03:42] <@SoleilMoonFrye> very cool
[03:43] <@SoleilMoonFrye> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neil_Hamburger
[03:43] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he's a great man
[03:44] <@Tigger_> oh him
[03:44] <@Tigger_> He has performed his brand of comedy, much of it anti-humor, 
[03:44] <@SoleilMoonFrye> yeah
[03:44] <@Tigger_> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-humor
[03:45] <@Tigger_> how about that
[03:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> interesting thing is that he said he wants the audience to laugh
[03:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he doesn't like it when they scream out telling him to get off
[03:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> which is what they do most of the time
[03:45] <@SoleilMoonFrye> like he doesn't get off on annoying people
[03:46] <@Tigger_> so he's not trying to be bad?
[03:46] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he started out as being intentionally bad
[03:46] <@SoleilMoonFrye> but the comedy got a lot better
[03:46] <@SoleilMoonFrye> so it's actually really funny
[03:47] <@SoleilMoonFrye> his persona is highly odd though
[03:47] <@SoleilMoonFrye> quite disgusting
[03:47] <@Tigger_> in what way?
[03:47] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he holds a whole bunch of beers a lot
[03:47] <@SoleilMoonFrye> under his arm
[03:47] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and drinks, spills them all over himself
[03:47] <@SoleilMoonFrye> spits
[03:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> coughs
[03:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> the coughing is the really unpleasant part
[03:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> he coughs right into the microphone point blank
[03:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> as loud as he can
[03:48] <@SoleilMoonFrye> makes you want to put your fingers in your ears
[03:49] <@SoleilMoonFrye> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnoj-3mIlVw
[03:49] <@SoleilMoonFrye> watch that
[03:49] <@Tigger_> maybe he's not really a comedian, but just a loony
[03:49] <@SoleilMoonFrye> no he's quite funny
[03:49] <@Tigger_> got my downloads going
[03:50] <@SoleilMoonFrye> shouldn't really be a problem
[03:50] <@Tigger_> later
[03:51] <@Tigger_> downloading Shallow Grave now
[03:52] <@SoleilMoonFrye> oh old school
[03:52] <@Tigger_> never seen it before
[03:53] <@Tigger_> but Rocky Balboa looks nice
[03:53] <@Tigger_> love these 720p's
[03:53] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i just got donnie brasco
[03:53] <@SoleilMoonFrye> great film
[03:53] <@Tigger_> in HD I hope?
[03:53] <@SoleilMoonFrye> of course not
[03:53] <@Tigger_> :(
[03:54] <@Tigger_> you are only hurting yourself by making yourself suffer so
[03:54] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i don't have a plasma 
[03:54] <@SoleilMoonFrye> so it's not going to make a difference
[03:55] <@Tigger_> I think my download of Donnie Brasco was 6.5gb
[03:56] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hahah
[03:56] <@Tigger_> well worth it though
[03:56] <@SoleilMoonFrye> if you can justify the quota
[03:57] <@Tigger_> better to have quality over kwantity
[03:58] <@SoleilMoonFrye> lol
[03:59] <@Tigger_> tomorrow night I'll download the Marlon Brando 'Mutiny on the Bounty'
[03:59] <@SoleilMoonFrye> doesnt players like vlc just load it automatically
[03:59] <+PrometheanStardust> Don't* players, you illiterate!
[04:00] <@Tigger_> if it shares the same name before the file extension
[04:00] <@SoleilMoonFrye> lol
[04:00] <@Tigger_> what are you doing tonight PrometheanStardust?
[04:00] <@SoleilMoonFrye> im going to bed shortly
[04:00] <+PrometheanStardust> I was getting some Lucy Lee porn and watching Youtube videos
[04:00] <+PrometheanStardust> I'm download Solaris and Stalker DVD9's
[04:00] <@Tigger_> a productive night
[04:00] <+PrometheanStardust> And now Russian Ark
[04:01] <@Tigger_> oh excellent PrometheanStardust!
[04:01] <+PrometheanStardust> Russian Ark is a DVDRip though
[04:01] <@Tigger_> they're vob rips are they?
[04:02] <+PrometheanStardust> One is, but Solaris is made up of two .Iso files, I should be able to extract them though and watch it on my computer?
[04:02] <@Tigger_> yes
[04:02] <+PrometheanStardust> Excellent
[04:02] <@Tigger_> possibly your video player can load the iso anyway
[04:02] <@Tigger_> see SoleilMoonFrye, this is what you do for the sake of having the best
[04:02] <@SoleilMoonFrye> hehe
[04:03] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i'm not that fussed
[04:03] <@SoleilMoonFrye> if i had an HD plasma i'd be interested
[04:03] <@Tigger_> I'll wait till they're on bluray though, I already have the Criterion dvd of Solaris
[04:03] <@SoleilMoonFrye> end is probably leeching the soderberg version
[04:04] <+PrometheanStardust> SoleilMoonFrye, shut up and go download a .700mb avi
[04:04] <@Tigger_> that would be a major blow
[04:04] <@Tigger_> hehe
[04:05] <+PrometheanStardust> Solaris is the Criterion Collection one, so it wouldn't be the Soderberg version
[04:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> end is now realising he's leeched the soderberg version
[04:05] <@Tigger_> I think everyone has forgotten the Soderberg version exists anyway
[04:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and is getting defensive
[04:05] <@SoleilMoonFrye> enjoy george clooney though end!
[04:05] <+PrometheanStardust> Apparently Clooney was very upset when people dared to criticse the Soderberg version
[04:06] <@Tigger_> that would've kept him busy
[04:06] <@SoleilMoonFrye> i like the soderberg version
[04:06] <@SoleilMoonFrye> easily clooney's best film
[04:06] <@Tigger_> it's a shocker
[04:07] <@SoleilMoonFrye> one of the better remakes
[04:07] <@SoleilMoonFrye> and it has a member from L O S T in it
[04:07] <@Tigger_> it is like Rob Schneider deciding to remake 2001
[04:07] <@SoleilMoonFrye> LOL
[04:08] <@SoleilMoonFrye> that is unfair Tigger_
[04:08] <@Tigger_> the works of great directors are never to be tampered with
[04:08] <@Tigger_> never to be remade
[04:09] <@SoleilMoonFrye> time for bed. russian ark will be finished in 1 hour
[04:09] <@SoleilMoonFrye> tomorrow shall be russian ark day
[04:09] <@Tigger_> like that other idiot who thought he could remake Psycho
[04:09] <@Tigger_> ok, night then SoleilMoonFrye
[04:09] <@SoleilMoonFrye> goodnight!
[04:09] <@SoleilMoonFrye> goodnight end, enjoy mr. clooney's wooden acting!